Sep 3, 2015

Fight Carnage Updates

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Earlier today I spoke with some of the developers about some updates made to the Fight Carnage feature. The thing the players will like the most is that the experience to stamina ratios have been increased for the second time. We started out with ratios as low as 1.70, they were increased to about 2.20 [1][2]. Now the ratios are now in the 2.25 range and can go up to 2.80. This still isn't the desired ratio of 2.30 but it's better than it was before. There are more updates in store and Zynga plans on getting more feedback from fighters. Rather than bitch, moan and tell people who they should play the game or what they should like, we should hope that Zynga finds a solution to make all players happy. I for one am grateful that their solution for the server issues wasn't to find a way to stop or hinder fight scripts. These updates show that they are trying.

The next thing that they did was change the number of fights won. Before one giant attack would count as 1 win. Now the attacks are calculated by the amount of stamina used. Every 5 stamina counts as 1 win. My attacks cost 3,000 stamina and this attack counted as 600 wins. The extra one is from the Jab.
 The threshold of 200 stamina has been eliminated [1]. We can now attack all the way to 0 stamina. The addition of the Jabs made it possible to 'Jab' away your left over stamina but now we can use whatever remains to attack the same player. You can see from the images below that I had 6 stamina left. The Jab cost 5 and now the 1 can be used to attack the same opponent. Before this update, if there was less than 200 stamina, it could not be used to attack a player beyond a Jab. Jabs don't appear to count towards fights lost so if you avoid attacking a target for the 2nd time after losing a Jab you won't waste much stamina and your fights lost won't go up as much as before.

58 comments:

  1. That's a joke right? Every time you post something you whine and complain about the game and how incompetent Zynga is in doing something. You only care when it effects YOUR gameplay.

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    1. Not much effects my gameplay because I adapt. I realized years ago that the game was shifting and fighting was not important. My goal at the time was to have 100K attack and 100K defense. Instead I added my points to energy and stamina and became a serial leveler. It's been so obvious that Zynga caters to script abusing serial leveling accounts. I bitch and moan when they do nothing about things that are wrong. I'm sorry that this effected your gameplay and they are trying so we can all hope that they adjust things so the fighters are happy too.

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  2. Okay, I must be awfully dim. Perhaps I don't understand what is meant by LIMITED TIME EVENT. Even now, they're telling everyone it is a LIMITED TIME EVENT, so why are they wasting their time on fight carnage? If it turns out they've lied and they don't switch it back, then some people will take them to task on it.

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  3. So when all the loading issues and other game performance problems come back, and they will, then what?

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  4. The problem from "our side" still isn't about performance. The problem as I see it is that Zynga has forgotten their customer.

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  5. limited time....zynga has all control over that, limited could mean till the game gets shut down, I hate some of the changes but so do all of you, if it is that bad then go play something else, remember when Bangkok came out, it was a byatch but we all did it roll with the flow or quit, tired of the bitching, I for one play less and now spending less but not giving up yet

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  6. They are already coming back (loading issues). I've been getting the whit and gray pages for the past few days now so I call BS to Fight Carnage being the answer to the loading issue problem.

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    1. It seemed to solve the loading issues for me I only noticed the loading issues start again even though not nearly as bad was the day siege came out. I'm guessing it's because that is rather click heavy as well. Basically slow your siege clicking down to once per 5 seconds like fighting now is and the game would load fine once more.

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    2. I haven't been doing the siege so what would be your next idea for the reason that the white pages are back?

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    3. he was kidding about slowing your clicks down, right? has to be that or maybe a zynga employee?

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  7. So what happened to the meeting that was supposed to include other MW players? I know of 2 specific players that were supposed to be included in this and they haven't heard anything about a meeting happening. My problem with this is that not all levels of players were represented if in fact this was just a conference between you, Loot Lady and Zynga and that all concerns, not just of FC, were not addressed.

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    1. It was just me, they were only telling me about the updates. I've been talking to them for years so it's not a big deal when they call on skype to ask me questions or give me information. I'm sure they plan on talking to fighters. I straight up told them that I'm not the best person to ask about this stuff. I like the feature.

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  8. You shouldn't comment on things you know nothing about... You are not a fighter... Give credit where it's due... I thank you for some things you have posted for years but PLEASE stay out of carnage

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    1. I told them they would get better feedback from fighters. I'm sorry you think that fighting is rocket science, it's not that complicated and I do know more than nothing about it. I like Fight Carnage and told them that the ones complaining should be the ones they ask. This wasn't a call to get my opinion, they were simply giving me information about the updates and that's what this post is about.

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    2. This blog is a joke .... I have never posted on here & the one time in all my years of play you censor what I said ... Stay out of our fighting game !!!

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    3. I've posted all comments made about this issue. Maybe if you didn't post as anonymous your comment would have a better chance of making it. I don't look at the spam folder because there are over 1,000 spam comments a day and some real comments end up there. If I was censoring, half the comments you are reading here would be gone. It's not YOUR game so you can't tell anyone to stay out of anything. Talk to Zynga if you don't like what I say or better yet stay away from this site. Seems pretty simple to me. Go make a fighting blog.

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  9. If we didnt bitch about it in the first place ,nothing wouldve been done.You obviously are clueless.

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    1. lol, it was stated from the beginning that things would change. he survey was made for that reason. A lot of things have changed. If your bitching was so much more important than others than you wouldn't need to resort to trolling in order to feel like your opinion matters.

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    2. "Mafia Wars Loot LadySeptember 4, 2015 at 6:48 AM
      lol, it was stated from the beginning that things would change. he survey was made for that reason"

      Then why did they call it a 'limited time event.' That is fraud, and it is actionable. Fraud is not covered under their ToS, so they can't rely on the part where it states that they can make changes to the game without notice, if they committed to players in writing that fighting would return to normal, and they did exactly that.

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  10. Ratios, Recorded fight wins and using a tiny amount of stamina? That is all great if your primary concern is with leveling and what not....I know you are not a fighter and really don't get that aspect of the game, but the Carnage event is about fighting!!! None of the things you mentioned are at the top of the list, though ratios is certainly important to all accounts...

    How about the 5-7 (at it's best) sec lag when you attack?
    The shortened heal timer?
    The waste of stamina, with a fraction of the ices you used to get?
    All of these things affect the fighters and have turned their game upside down...
    Zynga has to either add the Carnage as a third fighting option or get rid of it!

    The fighters are the only people left putting any significant $$$ into the game at this point, if they do not fix it, the game will be shuttered..

    PLEASE find a fighting account and get them involved!!!!!

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    1. They are planning on talking to fighters. These were other things that they changed based on other feedback. My guess would be they were easy fixes. What the fighters are complaining about probably aren't as easy to change.

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    2. Probably right, glad to hear they are going to talk to fighters, hopefully they will find a good cross section, not just monsters, thought the basic flaws hurting fighting are pretty universal...

      Thanks for talking your time to contribute in regards to your playing style. I am sure it will help the game! I missed saying that in my original post ;)

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  11. I just want to fight period

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  12. This is just pure BS. As for the server issues it has to do with Zynga trying to reduce their serverspace not that scripts have made the servers go down in performance. Just look at the huge drop in dayly/weekly players for this game over time and every mentally sane person should see that they would have increased the capacity on their serverload. So the lagging servers must be the fact that Zynga is reducing the capacity on their servers letting the players suffer for their greedy chase for profit.

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  13. I've seen some of the biggest family's at war with each other, they are not bitch about this fight carnage they just get in with it like I do, I've never lvl'd so much nor killed so many people. The higher return in xp will just help in that fact. Thank you for the update jen, keep up the great work :-)

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  14. Thanks for the info, MWLL, the ratio in your picture is wrong, it's should be 2.25 not 2.5.
    To all those whinging about Fight Carnage, everything in the game is beta so Zynga can change whatever they want whenever they want.
    If they kept stamina ratio as that of the old fight system, as a fighter I really couldn't care less, it will just mean I can level quicker by burning through my stamina much easier.
    What annoys me the most is that the ratio is lower then the previous system. With 173K stamina at the previous max of a 2.3 ratio it would give me 397900 XP, Now with the Fight Carnage at most it was a 2.2 ratio which is only 380600 XP, That's a difference of 17300 XP or 7.9K Stamina I need to find, Even with the new 2.25 ratio it only gives 389250 XP (8650 XP less or 3.9K stamina)
    The Stamina ratio fighting was already lower the the highest you can get from energy (with consumables) and similar to non consumable jobs, Fair enough Zynga want to increase server performance by streamlining the fight system yet again, but I don't see why they would need to adjust the ratio to give energy a greater importance over stamina when it already was the higher benefit stat.

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  15. The one thing that no one talks about notices is this. Large stamina pool accounts need large amounts of stamina per attack and they do a very large amount of damage.
    Small stamina pool accounts use less stamina and do WAY less damage per attack.
    Our family is in a perpetual war state :)
    ANYHOW , the result is some accounts that used to ice me , obviously small stamina pool players , can never ice me before I heal. and the large accounts of course can always get an ice before healing. I can look at my attackers and even guess what their stamina pool is just by looking at the amount of damage they can do per attack.

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  16. Please may I ask, what use it that "the number of fights won" has been corrected, what difference does it make to anything if I have 1 win or 600?
    Andy Grecco

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    1. For game play it makes no difference. I guess some players complained that the number of fights won on the stats page was going to be effected.

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  17. First I'd like to say Thank You for all you do ! Secondly I to really like the Carnage , more so as it originally came out , I've heard from a lot of players that don't and am not certain what I am doing differently than they are but it has greatly increased the speed of getting my daily ices done therefore has increased my leveling time allowing me to get more energy tasks done also.

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    1. If you fight only to get game tasks done, then I imagine you're not offended by the changes they have made; you'll just set your fight script to settings that will allow you to have an optimal icing experience. But, if you are fighting in a war, or if you like to retaliate those who attack you--the very things that make the game enjoyable for fighters who spend a lot of money to get strong for the purposes of winning against bigger and bigger players--then fight carnage makes fighting a miserable experience. The five second 'server relief' feature they have added, plus the reduced heal timers make it absolutely impossible to singlehandedly ice a rival who has high health, and part of the joy for those who love to fight is having the ability to ice an opponent in a retaliation fight or war. Until they dispose of these two features, it will continue to render the most important feature of the game to fighters, useless. The high stamina per click, and attack damage based on stamina pool also do not help matters.

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    2. p.s. It also took me 3 levels of stamina (at 120K stamina pool) to max out on fight/arena consumables for the Overlords event. Before Carnage, I could max out on consumables with less than 1500 stamina. The drop rate for loot/consumables is DISGUSTING.

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  18. So all of this for just a call about updates? They could have just posted about that on their FB page. And if you have been talking to them all this time that just confirms they don't give a damn about player's opinions. You cancelled your VIP because they don't listen but they call you so they can talk about updates? Have you mentioned some of the problems to them on this call? Kinda strange they would speak to someone about a issue that the person doesn't care about in the first place.

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    1. See my comment below. Yes I always wondered why they don't post more things on their own pages. It was just a friendly call in which they told me what was changed. I imagine they didn't want it to go unnoticed or they didn't want someone to get it wrong if it was noticed. Obviously I care enough to make blog posts about it.

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  19. So did you ask them how they think the game is going with all the changes to fighting? How about their take on the declining metrics? Or what big changes can we expect for the rest of the day? I would hope someone running a blog about the game would ask them these questions considering how the rest of us can't get anywhere with them.

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    1. If I could post about everything that was asked and said than there would be much more interesting blog posts here. I signed an NDA so I can only talk about what they give me permission to. Not ideal but if I never signed it than they would never talk to me.

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    2. Then what's the point of talking to them if you can't tell us what they said? They could just post all of that themselves without involving you. What am I missing here?

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    3. You would have to ask them. Not sure what you are missing. I post about what I can and stuff that I can't I don't say anything about. If I went against their wishes than they wouldn't tell me anything in the future.

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    4. They won't talk to any of us besides a select few Loot Lady. That's the point. You seem to be one of the select few and it's disappointing to some of us that the big questions we have still go unanswered. And if you actually did get them you couldn't talk about them anyway which makes zero sense. Why even tell us your speaking with them if you can't tell us anything they said besides updates they can post on their wall? You have done a great job over the years Loot Lady. But these are basic questions from paying customers that deserve answers.

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  20. I´m done with that BS.
    I spent a brandnew car in my account, never used a kami.
    But this brainless boring carnage is not the game i played near 7 years.
    So i will give them more serverspeed and close my game down.
    Nevermore a Zynga Game.

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    1. Don't let the door hit you in the ass

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    2. Another Zynga employee comes to visit!! Lol

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    3. You paid for a Mercedes and they delivered a Yugo.

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  21. Jen, make up your damn mind. You either like it or not. Now just telling us this. Carnage is the dumbest damn "limited time event" in history. Screw your ratio. It's nt all about you. Some.....most, people are not as large as your account and not everyone spends money on their account such as you self admittedly do. No use in talking down to "us" the common player. No, fighting isn't "rocket science". but it's like football, baseball or basketball......it's a game. It's one on one, team vs team or just freelance like the fight list. Had Zynga been told up front that this idea would tank maybe it would not have gone this far; but now it has. Stories of Zynga moving to Amazon severs to getting more servers. (They are just an operating cost and a tax write off) so Zynga needs to remember that before using that b.s. excuse. We're united......not idiots

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    1. I haven't spent money on reward points for years. Since I became a serial leveler there is no need to. I also canceled my VIP subscription so now I spend $0. It isn't all about me. I like Fight Carnage but I've posted the reasons why some don't. I don't care what they do, I will be able to adapt no matter what. I don't think it tanked. It solved the loading issues and those with a lot of stamina love it. It's just the fighters and Zynga is going to talk to some of them to try to adjust it.In the end, Zynga will do what they want to do, we have seen that time and time again. No matter what I say, it will make no difference . No use getting mad at me, I'm just trying to be the messenger.

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    2. You spend nothing, not a fighter, and likes the carnage event so Zynga contacts you to be thier messenger? Makes total sense to me..lmao

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    3. When has Zynga ever made sense? You shouldn't look a gift horse in the mouth.

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    4. You are calling Zynga a gift horse? Wow...

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    5. lol, when it comes to them giving me information, yes. I may not like the information they give but at least they have the lines of communication open. I would have never noticed these updates and I didn't see anyone post them anywhere. I agree they could post them on their sites but they don't seem to like to do that.

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  22. If I only was into fulfilling the tasks given by the game - get my daily family xps, get the events done and max all properties etc, then the carnage would not be as bad. But the reason for me to get events done and to max out my family xps is to get stronger. Get more personal and more mafia skills. And why would I bother to get all this loot and points if I dont want to take them into a direct fight and competition with others at my level or higher? This part of the game has always been the one that separated MW from other games that all work with the same structure - no, I dont want to mention Farmville again :) . Thats the reason why I have been playing this and not any other game. Thats what drove everyone to spend more money. As an autoleveler - as you say Jen - you dont need to pay for anything. You will get all events done and have all the loot items you want without paying any extras. If you just keep adding to energy and stamina, you will continuously level. But for those that need extra skills in attack and defense its necessary to spend some rps from time to time and if you cant get enough from leveling, you might be ready to pay for them - may it be in form of a membership or by buying rps via game cards. On your example Zynga should be able to tell who is going to be ready to spend more money on the game in future. So I really dont understand why the latest inventions they made all directed into a better developement for autolevelers and the fighters always have to fight to get a gamesetting that allows them to continue playing. The carnage allows us to use up our stamina faster? Well, great! Actually I added so much stamina to my account to be able to last longer in fights like battles, Drive Bys, FFA, Mock Wars... what ever you want to call them. I DONT WANT MY STAMINA TO BE USED UP FASTER!!!

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    1. EXACTLY!
      Most people with kamis that can keep leveling also don't spend money. Im glad they are keeping the ratios up for them

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  23. ... I must admit that the JAB made a big improvement on the Carnage and I am finally able to get my daily ices again. But if I cant chose how much stamina exactly I am willing to spend on a single oponent because its getting taken in big bundles I dont care how much damage I can do on someone who just runs his account on 500 % health. I will only see that after a few hits and then I have already spent a big load of my stamina, while usually I would have moved on to someone else. Also in those fight situations mentioned above its not really my purpose to use up my stamina fast. A battle lasts 1 - 4 hours, a Drive By or Mock War very often way longer - in some cases a whole weekend. So what is the purpose on using up my stamina so fast. And honestly, we already had so many health monsters that it was hard sometimes to get them down before they reheal. With the shortened reheal timer from the carnage, it has become pointless. Yes, I can run a script and will get my ices, but the fun and the thrill lay in the direct competition with another player - manually. Yes, really, I still do that! It makes me sad that instead of developing the game into something that gives everyone a new thrill to play and to improve their skills, more and more people keep running their scripts without even looking at their screen anymore and after a while this just gets boring and you can tell they are leaving. Instead Zynga tries to save on the costs for the game by reducing server space. I believe that if they took a little money into their hands and made a run for some more thrill in the game, there are still enough people that are ready to play and pay for the game and they could earn "a golden nose" as we say in our country. I really dont cuss here because I think with this game they have something at hand that could be awesome and financially also worth for them to focus on. Zynga has developed a lot of great features for this game in the past and not everything was bad that we didnt like at the beginning. But with this form of carnage they frustrated all the fighters that had to struggle to find THEIR way of playing the game for a while anyway. So far we always had the choice to pick what we wanted to be - autolevel or fighter - there was a way to get along. Now this wont be possible anymore. Did you really not understand why so many long time and high amounts of cash paying players quit the game long time ago and more and more keep quitting? Please turn it around and make it awesome for everyone.

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    1. Perfectly put and echoes my feelings.

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  24. I've cancelled VIP and haven't levelled in a week. I am a fighter who likes to do mocks, drivebyes and wars. With carnage that has now gone by the wayside. Us fighters are the big spenders in this game and they have basically snubbed us. Once again Zynga in their infinite greed thought if they made it where fighters had to pay to fight they would make out big time. WRONG us fighters have already lined Zynga's pockets by building our accounts to fight continuously. I refuse to play if I have to pay to fight. they've gotten the last dime from me and I hope the rest of the fighters give it up. Stupid thing is if they would of listened to the players Mafia Wars would've been their cash cow.

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    1. Keeping carnage is a very nice way for the entire MW team to do themselves out of a job. My home feed is polluted with hourly notices from fellow MW players saying they've cancelled their VIPs and are quitting the game after 5, 6, 7 years. People aren't willing to wait any longer to see if zynga reverses this stupid mistake.

      I have spent a few thousand on the game, which, in comparison to many I know, is a pittance, and all those who I know personally are spending big for no other reason than to become stronger so they can fight better, because it is supposed to be a fighting game and fighting is what they like to do. Zynga has screwed over the ones who do spend money. There's no doubt about that, and this fact will very soon come to light if they refuse to get rid of carnage.

      My guess is zynga has already done irreversible financial damage to themselves, because many who have already quit VIP won't likely sign up again, so the longer carnage drags on, and more people quit, the less chance this game has of surviving for much longer.

      So I guess all those who fail to support fighters in getting rid of carnage, whether their own style of play is affected by it or not, will soon be able to congratulate themselves for expediting closure of the game, and then no one will be happy about the result because no one will be able to play.

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    2. I check each day to see if Carnage 'event' is over, then leave. I have no interest anymore in the game as it has become. I'm keeping it in a 'holding pattern' in case it changes.
      The loading issues are exactly the same as before Carnage.
      I hope Zynga reads your blog and knows that I won't spend any more money on this game that they have created with the changes.

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  25. I think the Loot Lady has done a great job over the years giving all of us players good game info and advice. I think all of who truly love this game is frustrated with Zynga. I had a fighting account for over six years and I can tell you that they are a very loyal and dedicated group of players. For us the whole game revolved around fighting and improving your character to win more fights. Our culture included wars, mocks, and drive bys that went on for weeks and months at a time. Lots of friendships were made during these events and really made for some good memories. Now with changes to the fighting alot of my friends still playing are ready to quit. Very sad development to lose these great players and people due to Zyna's incompetence. I don't use that word lightly but in this case it's entirely appropriate. I hope all of you can enjoy the game while it's still around. Have a good night..

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